Perry and Sam discuss why they think client project processes are critical to the long-term success of creative agencies, talk about their biggest client process failures, and share what agency owners can learn about project communication from the infamous Domino’s Pizza Tracker.
Resources from the episode:
[Designing Growth introduction plays]
Welcome to designing growth. The podcast that helps owners and founders create the business of their dreams by thinking critically about the most important and often most challenging aspect of growing an agency, client relationships from first proposal to final delivery, the founding team of motion.io will share their own experiences alongside that of guests to help you market your services better, complete projects, faster and exceed client expectations at every step of the way.Let’s get it moving.
[Sam Chlebowski starts speaking, hosting episode 6 with Motion.io Co-founder Perry Rosenbloom]
Happy Thursday, everyone. And welcome back to designing growth. Excited for another great episode. This week, I have our, my guest Perry Rosenblum joining us again on the show. And this week we are going to really take a deep dive into something that I think is critical for agencies and Perry. And I have learned from our own experience.
It is critical. But also a big part of what we’re doing at Motion.io. And that is your process of working with clients. So whether you are a website design agency, whether you’re a graphic design agency, a marketing agency in all of these types of businesses, clients and client relationships are so central.
To your growth and your ability to scale and take on more clients over time and create happier clients that are gonna generate referrals and help your business grow. So really excited to be diving into this and dissecting, you know, why we think. Your process of working with clients is so important to your growth.
And then also breaking down the individual pieces of that process and the things that you need to be accounting for in the ways that you work with clients. So without further ado, Perry, I want to ask you first, how you doing today?
I’m doing great, man. It’s another beautiful day in paradise here in Boulder, Colorado.
Uh, I get to spend my afternoon chatting with you about, uh, clients and process and. I’m in heaven, man. How are you doing? Love it. I’m doing good, man. It’s been a busy week, but a fun week, really taking a deep dive into a lot of the copy of the motion.io product. How we like describe what Motion.io is to customers. And that’s been fun.
Something I know you’ve been doing a lot of this week is speaking with potential customers of motion dot IU. You wanna tell me just a little bit more about that and how that’s going?
Yeah. You, you know, I’d actually more frame it as listening to potential customers. We’re, we’re a customer led organization, even from our earliest days here, you know, we wanna make sure at motion.io that what we’re building is the right thing.
And is valuable. And so we have a launch list of folks we’ve been speaking with, uh, for the last six, seven months or so on and off. And we’re having a second, third round of conversations with folks to, to kind of update them about where we are, find out where they are, if any changes in their process have happened thus far and asking new questions to help us understand, you know, what problems they’re facing.
And as we continue diving deeper on their problems, To make sure that what we’re building solves those problems. And so it’s a constant process of, you know, in any SaaS company of you build you, listen, you go back, you build some more, you listen some more and just working through that whole, that whole flow.
And circle of development. Yeah. And I wanted to ask you about some of those conversations you were having first because you even just shared something really insightful for me there that I also think applies to various types of creative agencies and online businesses. And it’s that importance of not just speaking with your customers, but also listening to them.
You know what we are trying to do here at motion.io is. Help agencies streamline their process, create happier relationships with their clients. And what you just said about listening relates directly to that, because if you are an agency listening to your clients and understanding their expectations and how you can use that information that you hear from customers to improve your own process is gonna be really beneficial to your growth as a business.
So I what wanted to start by asking you today is why do you think it is important for agencies who are working with clients to always be improving their process, always be looking for, you know, new tools and new ways of doing things. What is the central reason of why that you think that matters?
Well, your process is the lifeblood of your organization, right?It doesn’t matter how excellent of a designer you are. If a client comes in the. And your process is just utter disaster. The client is gonna be upset from the get go. You might close that client and the design might be beautiful in the end, but they’re gonna be left with the sour taste in their mouths of how that process went.
And so managing client expectations and setting clients, setting and managing client expectations and having a streamlined process is really how you’re going to make sure that your. Can actually grow and thrive. Otherwise you’re gonna be on this treadmill all the time of unhappy customers, putting out fires and never really get to do what you love to do, which is for a lot of folks it’s design.
It’s not having a fire extinguisher in one hand and putting out client fires, right? Yeah. You want to be creating, you want to be designing. You don’t want to have to be chasing down. Clarifying things that were miscommunicated in your first call with that person later on down the road. And I love that you immediately started to dive into expectations because I think that is one of the most important things in having a good process for working with clients is setting those expectations and then meeting those expectations.
From initial proposal to final delivery of a project, because it’s like what you said, that is the critical piece of what it means to work with a client that if they are unhappy with the process, it might not matter about the end result. So, so one thing, uh, that we’re, we’re doing here at motion that I think is super exciting is we’re allowing motion users.
And encouraging them right from the get, go to be able to share with clients in a really simple portal slash client dashboard, what’s going on with the project what’s expected of each party, where people are in the progress with an auto updating progress tracker. That’s kind of like a Domino’s pizza tracker.
Like, you know, if you order from domino. and, you know, I haven’t done it in years, but like the thing that made Domino’s so successful these days is they Domino’s pizza tracker. You know, what’s happening with your pizza when it’s going the oven, when it’s gone on the, on the delivery van and when it’s gonna be at your door and we wanna bring that same kind of process and communication of process to motion.io customers and their clients.
And so that’s something that we’re really bringing to the table here is making sure that you can always. easily communicate with your clients. What the progress tracker is and where, where your client is in its, where your project is in its life cycle. Do you think there is sometimes a tendency for, and you know, you and I both worked at an agency together and grew and scale that agency.
And I’ll tell you my answer after this, but do you think that there is a tendency to side with clients wanting to know less versus more as the person. Producing the work, you know, that was something interesting that we uncovered in some of our conversations. They were definitely in some of our conversations with potential motion users.
There were definitely a lot of folks out there that said, I don’t wanna peel back the curtain. I don’t want my clients to know any deadlines cause I may have to stick to it. Well, you know, the problem with that as a business is it’s like, if you can’t stick to your deadlines or at least communicate with your client, when the deadlines are changing, what kind of business are you gonna have?
Uh, you know, we, we wanna help people succeed and thrive. And it, if you, if you’re like, if you’re too scared to communicate, what’s going on with the project to your client, I gotta tell you your business isn’t long for this world, or you gotta hire somebody or fix your process to make sure that you are okay with communicating with your client.
Like, Hey, this is when we’re gonna get this to. Or, ah, shit, we didn’t get this to you on time. We’re not gonna get this to you on time. And here’s why, and managing those communications and, you know, being a professional about that is how you’re gonna differentiate yourself from all the other garbage out there, uh, from all the other businesses out there that are too scared to communicate with their clients.
About what’s going on behind the seeds and, and sharing the progress of the project that they’re paying you a lot of money for, right? Like, you know, it’s not like this is just like a hundred dollars, one off project. You’re talking about thousands. Sometimes tens of thousands of dollars. Clients need to know what’s going on with that.
And deserve to know. So what’s, what’s your take, Sam?
My take is almost the exact same as yours. And you had actually hit on something that I wanted to talk about next, which is some of these expectations that clients have. Well, every agency in the way they work with clients is unique. I think that there are three key factors and you actually alluded to them already that fall right in line with what client expectations are in a general sense.
And if you can categorize these and find how to deliver on these expectations, it’s going to help you grow. So I just wanna talk through them beginning with the first one, which is my belief. Clients expect you to complete the work that they are paying for shocker there, right? yeah. Yeah. And as I was writing this down and, you know, kind of taking stock of the things that I had learned about meeting client expectations, working at brighter vision, our previous agency, I wrote this down and I was immediately like, Oh, this, this is so obvious.
Why am I even wasting a bullet point on this? But as I dove into it, I was like, it’s really not as cut and dry as it might seem, because there have been countless times where I’ve been speaking with a client and I’m responding to a support ticket or something. And. It wasn’t immediately clear to the client what we were doing for them versus what we were not doing for them.
Even though we had those things, you know, on a pricing page on our website, it was included in an agreement when you were working on a more technical project with a non-technical. Client, they might assume that you’re doing things that you are not. And I think it’s important. And what I’ve found for myself, that is, was really important to do with clients on initial inquiry calls was to have a list of the things that people have been confused about in the past and make sure I call those out.
if they don’t come up in the conversation automatically, you know, for example, if I’m speaking with a client during an initial sales call and they ask that classic question of what else should I be asking that I’m not it’s at that point that I would cover? Well, here are, here are the services that we do here are some things that other people sometimes think we do that we don’t do.
And having that clarity ahead of time. And so that, that kind of like circles back nicely to, to what we were talking about at the beginning here of, of listening to your customers, right? Like after you complete a project, you wanna be able to understand how you, how you did on that. And so part of your process with all of your projects should be reflection.
We finished this project, let’s reflect internally on what went well and let’s understand from the client’s perspective. What went well, and more importantly, what went really poorly and being able to take that feedback and internalize it and improve your process, or if there’s nothing you really can improve upon, if you say, you know, this bug is actually working as intended here, maybe you can communicate that to a client ahead of.
So that, that bug in your process or that perceived bug in your process, they know it’s like, Hey, that’s kind of intended that that’s intentional there. We’re, we’re not actually gonna be doing all of your SEO and get you ranking on the first page for, uh, you know, house cleaner NYC. You know, you, you’re gonna have to go out and, and pay a lot more money than what you’re paying us to be able to do that.
Your example about SEO is something that falls right in line. With why I thought that this idea that clients expect you to complete the work that they are paying for is a little bit deeper than you think it is. Because on your website, you can say, yes, we’ll do SEO for all of your pages on your website, in the, to the client.
They could be hearing, oh, you’re gonna get, get me ranking on the first page of Google overnight. And so then that’s expectations with that example. You’re still doing the same things. Yeah. That you are still doing your things and your work. But the client expectations need to be adjusted in terms of what the outcome of that work is gonna be.
Yeah. Yeah. Completely agree. And the way that I like to be able to meet that client expectation, I think is an, a good thing for agencies to internalize is when you are reflecting on these projects, make a list of any of the things. A client had a misaligned expectation from your own and document that somewhere, make sure that, you know, Hey, this is something this person had a question about. They were upset about it. So you can improve upon it next time.
Oh, that is such an excellent piece of advice there. Like just having that living, breathing document of misaligned expectations. I don’t think that your entire team should see, right? Because if everybody’s on the same page of like, Hey, these are common misaligned expectations, the owners on your team are gonna go out and make, and like preemptively address those misaligned expectations.
So Sam, what were some things like at, at brighter vision out the agency we worked at from a, a communication standpoint, from our process that you think we just completely butchered. Like, like let’s tell our, tell our audience what, what we really messed up at from a communications imagining a communications standpoint.
Um, that way we can kind of maybe work in how we’re looking to solve that here at motion. Yeah. One of the things that I think was oftentimes especially challenging. Was meeting client expectations of clear timelines and clear communication early on in our process of ion, it was really easy to stay in constant communication with our customers because, you know, we had a few dozen clients when I first started, obviously this started to grow rapidly, but in that early phase, it was much easier to keep mental tabs on all of your customers know who you had to check in with, know who.
You know, might need a little bit more attention, but as you grow, that gets harder and harder. And I think one of the places where we fell short was giving clients really clear timelines and communication. One of the areas where I think we fell short was giving clients clear expectations and timelines and ways that they could communicate with us from.
The first time we spoke with them, it was something that we fixed eventually. How, how did we, how did we fix it? The biggest way that we were able to fix it is communicating with designers. Hey, if you haven’t heard from a person in X number of days, it’s time to reach out to them and having. A due date that is specifically about reaching out to them.
It might not even have a specific deliverable, a specific deliverable or a specific action tied to that. But what we started to understand is that if you don’t hear from a client or a client, doesn’t hear from you, you are inviting frustration into your process. Oh dude. So, so this gets me so excited.
Cause let’s talk about how we’re solving that. Cause I bet there’s so many people listening to this that are like, oh my. Yeah, I, I have that happen all the time to me. And, and we have two ways we’re looking to solve this at motion. One is an idea you actually came up with Sam. Can you, can you share our audience with like that, that view of like that happiness tracker?
That’s what we’re looking to get implemented here. Yeah. And I think that that’s a, a really good segue into talking about this specific idea, because one of the things that I learned about brighter vision, what I just shared is this exact idea that project management solutions, things like Trello, Asana or even Notion they’re really good at tracking due dates.
And the reason why they’re so good at tracking due dates is because those are intended for. Teams those products at their, the heart of their mission. They’re not intended to be a. Tool that you can use to effectively interface between, you know, internally your team and externally with the client where those project management software tools fall short is paying attention to the human side of a process and a project.
And one of the ideas that I’ve had with how we want to view client projects within motion is having a view where you can filter by the last time that you’ve. From a client. And the last time that you’ve connected with them, that to me is one of the best metrics for assessing the overall happiness of a client and assessing who might need a little bit more attention, who might need a more personalized approach where you’re reaching out you’re scheduling calls with them and who is just fine, logging into their client portal and handling the things that they need, you know, giving you.
Giving approval, signing off on things. So that view, I think, is a really great way to look at that and help streamline your process of reaching out to clients that I, I love that so much and we’re super stoked to be able to deliver something like that to, to our users here at motion. And then the, the other piece that you said was when was like the last time I reached out to this.
Uh, a as well like that, that’s easy to do if you have, you know, a few clients and it’s just like mental tabs, but something that we’re looking to solve about motion is that, you know, you can even your best clients, you’re gonna send something to them and clients that work best when they’re given, Hey, here is an email and here is the action I need you to do, but inevitably, you’re gonna have to resend that email two, three, sometimes even four times to get them to take that one single action.
And then taking that. Holds up your project. Like that piece tracker is gonna be stopped, uh, you know, 65% because you need the, the client to take that action. And so one thing we’re, we’re working on at motion as well is that there are automated reminders that get sent out to your client so that you don’t need to track that crap in your head.
You can say, Hey, here is my website for you. I need feedback. Let’s notify you every three to five days for. emotion will just take care of that. And then once that feedback is given that task is complete and you’re able to go in and manage that feedback with the client. And, and so just automating that, that outreach so that you don’t have to worry about when was the last time?
Uh, I, I asked Susan for, for that feedback there, let me, let me go check my emails and see it’s like, nah, that’s all taken care of for you. It’s all automated and it’s all gonna be understood by the. to, to be marked as resolved once the client, uh, completes the request that, that you need of them. And I love that you brought up feedback as the next part of this discussion Perry, because.
Feedback from my experience is one of the most incredibly important things to a client’s overall happiness. Uh, and one of the most challenging, right? , it’s one of the it’s by far, one of the most challenging things to do. And I think that sometimes, because it is so challenging, there’s a tendency to limit feedback or.
Put off, you know, larger feedback discussions because somebody on the design end doesn’t want to hear, Hey, just make it pop or make it look better. That’s not helpful feedback. And it can be really tough to get that type of feedback over and over again. So could you tell. Our audience a little bit about how we’re trying to solve that particular problem of feedback so that the feedback meets and exceeds client expectations while yeah.
Not requiring a ton of clarification on the other end. So, so, you know, there’s, there’s a few ways that that folks go about getting feedback, right? You can say. Hey, I’m using a tool. That’s gonna allow you to put a sticky note on the website and give any feedback that you want. We utilize a tool like that at brighter vision, uh, our old agency and that worked all right.
You know, the problem with it though, is like you said, you know, designers and clients speak different languages. And so you’re gonna get a lot of tangential unstructured feedback. That is challenging to analyze. That’s gonna be time consuming because you know, they left the same sticky note on all 30 pages in the footer that says my phone number.
Ends in a six, not an eight. And you know, you see 30 of those tasks and you’re like, oh my God, what am I gonna do? But it’s all the same task. And then you have to go individually and close it out in such a pain in the butt. So that’s one way, the second way is, you know, you’re gonna get on a phone call with the client or you’re gonna see them face to face, or you’re gonna do it zoom.
And it’s this long forty five, sixty minute call that, you know, frankly, isn’t all that productive. Generally. Sometimes it can be. That’s a lot of time to spend, uh, you know, you’re spending 45, 60 minutes to get like a mediocre amount of feedback. And then, then the third way that people do and that we’re seeing folks do it more often in agencies is here’s my deliverable.
And here’s like a Google drive or Google doc with all the questions I want you to answer. And we’re actually seeing lots and lots of folks do that. And that’s like the most common way folks are going about trying to get, get, get feedback these days. But the problem with. Is the a, the client has to look at the Google doc, see the question, find the corresponding page, find out where it’s associated with and then answer it in the Google doc.
And like, you know, there’s, sometimes you’re gonna answer it via email. Sometimes you’re not gonna know what you’re talking about. And so what we’re looking to do here at motion is provide a guided feedback system where you can ask those questions that you need. , but it will be displayed alongside the visual, alongside the deliverable so they can see number one.
And this is a question about the header. I, and what do you think about the, the header size here? You had said you wanted a really big, uh, header, really big example of your logo popping off the page here is, is this what you had in mind? And they can answer that question right there. So you can get the feedback that you need and start a conversation around that feedback, as opposed to, and, and it’s.
In this visual application, as opposed to a Google drive. So you’re able to reference it clearly. You’re not dealing with a ton of unstructured tangential feedback that, you know, you can’t really understand what it’s pointing to, or you have 30, you know, sticky notes about one number on the footer that you know, that that’s certainly aggravating to the client as well.
Um, and you know, it ideally will be able to push your projects forward in a streamlined fashion. So that’s how we’re thinking critically about your process to help you as an agency owner. And I wanted to circle back. To what you had mentioned when you’d started talking about feedback, which was how folks are doing it now and why we think that that is a problem.
It’s not just that we think it’s a problem. I, I just wanna, I just wanna emphasize though, right? Like it’s not that we think it’s a problem, it’s that the people we’ve spoken with have said this sucks. like, you know, we’ve, we’ve had, you know, 30, 40 conversations and people are. Yeah. I mean, it’s, it’s working, but it’s like the most broken part of my process.
It’s the most painful thing I have to do every single day is manage this feedback. So we thought there was a problem there. We didn’t realize how big of a problem it is for folks. Yeah, it’s an excellent point. And I can see it too, just coming from the client’s perspective of how immensely confusing that might be for a client, right.
And where that invites frustration on both sides. If you are sending them a Google drive file and their responding via email, and they have to open. You know, both things side by side, they’re writing an email on one tab, they are looking at a document or a design file on the other tab. That’s really confusing for a client and they might intentionally hold off on taking that step because it feels like such a big ask.
Ah, that’s such a great point. It really wraps up. A couple of the different things that we’re doing [email protected] is to make the things that you are asking of your clients, not seem like a chore, but instead making them feel like something that’s easy to do, that they are excited to do to get the outcome that they hope to achieve.
Initially, when they hired you and this outcome is going to totally exceed their expectations, cuz they were able to be involved in the process in a way that didn’t feel like it was a full-time job for them. That that’s so key right there. Right? Like with motion, anytime a client needs to do something, they’ll be sent an email with a link that they click and it takes them directly to what they need to do.
There’s no, you know, client portal that they go to that has this terrible UX with confusing colors and confusing navigation about, okay, well, well, here I am. What the hell am I supposed to do? Cause that’s just gonna get your client to balance. Our goal is to make it streamlined for you as the agency owner and streamlined for your client as well.
So I think that it’s super critical to reemphasize what we’re doing here at Motion and how we’re different from all those other project management tools that you’ve tried. And you’ve hated. We are building a tool where the UX, the user experience is designed perfectly for both you as the agency owner. and your clients, we are putting your clients first, just like you put your clients first. And that’s why we feel like we are going to build this kick ass product for agency owners, because we’re treating your clients in the same way that you treat your clients, which is on a PED. Because they’re your, they’re your lifeblood.
Right? Um, and so our UX, our user experience is designed to be simple, streamlined, and clean for both you and your clients. Should we, should we like wrap that up and put it in a commercial oh yeah. I like it. That is, uh, man, really just firing off the soundbites here today. For me, it all comes back to relationships.
You know, setting expectations are a big part of that relationship, but so is the way that you manage those relationships. At the end of the day, relationships are work, but the best relationships shouldn’t necessarily feel like work all the time. And I think that that’s what motion will enable agencies to do with their clients is have it feel much more natural, much less like they are Commanding their client to do something but more so they’re giving their clients the opportunity to play a role in the process. And they’re excited to help with those things.
Love it. I don’t have anything to add to that. I, I think we’ve, we’ve really talked about pretty effectively here about process, uh, Sam, what do you think?
And maybe we could kind of work to end this, on this question before we go into the great food we ate this week. um, I, I, I want to ask you first. I have my own thoughts, but what do you think was the most broken piece of our process at brighter vision? Cuz we are a huge freaking agency. We were building like 300 websites a month, but the problems we had. Are the same problems you all are facing. And so I want you to share with our audience what you think was the most broken piece of our process. Put you on the spot.
For me, for me, the most broken piece of our process previously was feedback and it was broken because the solutions out there are either built for internal use or. Two, can’t be customized to a specific use case. You know, what I would’ve loved to be able to do, you know, especially early on at brighter vision is send folks a send folks, different picture options, different color options, uh, styles for their logo, and have them tell me what they liked and disliked about them.
Before we went through the steps of building them a first draft. Because if they were, if they had the chance to give us that kind of feedback beforehand, it would’ve made the success rate and their overall happiness on the first draft, a lot higher meaning we were instead of having to go through multiple rounds of complete website revisions for people, we would be much closer on that first go round and we wouldn’t be inviting this kind of feedback that shows up in email threads and.
Gets looped into different discussions. I think that that’s why feedback ultimately gets broken a lot of times is because a client will leave a piece of feedback in an. and then we’ll start talking about something else. And then in a different email thread, there is a different piece of feedback that was still related to the first initial problem.
If it sounds confusing it’s because it is, but I feel like many of the agencies we’re speaking with now have experienced that firsthand. Yeah. A hundred percent. I mean, the folks we spoke to, I, I just, I had a great conversation with the gal this morning and she had the same exact problem and, and Motion.io’s there to fix that.
For me, the most broken piece of our process is very similar to what you said is that communication happened in all of these different mediums and there was no way to centralize all of that. So there was communication through our feedback tool. Through these sticky notes, there was communication via email.
There was communication via phone and there is no overarching way to have that all be visible to somebody. And that’s what we’re also, we’re working to solve here at motion. And, uh, I look forward to, to being able to share with the world in just a few weeks here, uh, what we’ve been up to so that you all can check it out and, and see how it can, you know, Positively impact the, the work and the world that, that you live in the work and the world that you live in.
That was a terrible sentence that can have an input that can positively impact the work you’re doing. What an awful sentence that was. Let’s make sure we keep that in there though. I will make a note to, uh, not remove that in post. The only thing I did was drill into. With what you had just shared with Perry about what you saw as one of the biggest problems we faced, um, in our process of writing, vision is why do you see so many different channels of communication and having a lack of centralized communication as being problematic?
What issues does that invite for you? Why do I see it as being problematic?
There’s no source of truth, like spending all this time, going from different communication modality to different communication modality. And it’s a drain. Like if I have to spend, okay, I am on a phone call for an hour, getting feedback, then I’m going through the sticky note feedback.
Then I’m going through and answering all these emails. When are you actually getting any work done? When are you actually making a decision with your client and implementing what they want done? If we. Process that in a centralized location, we’re gonna be able to save you all so much time and energy.
Yeah, for me, it is all of those things. And it’s really the idea that streamlined communication is a way to create better client relationships. It’s it means things are not getting lost. You know, deadlines are being met instead of missed and. Your client has the faith in you to be able to produce the best result possible.
So speaking of the best result possible, I saw the best result possible of a seafood weekend that I’ve ever seen.
What is I? I’ve never heard of this. Oh, seriously before. Oh my gosh. So, let’s talk about the best food we’ve had over this last week here. Right?
We’ll, ansition into the tasting conclusion here. So, uh, I was in New York this past weekend, seeing some family and I was taken to this restaurant, uh, on long island, uh, that was in this area of long island.
I have never been to, uh, my dad who grew up in New York. I’ve never been to. Just really off the beaten path on the north shore. This place is called Schultz’s, uh, S C H U L T Z. Y I love Schultz’s Schultz’s I, I love seafood, but you know, for me, most seafood restaurants, if there’s a good restaurant, it’s at this bar, that’s just really great. but this one, toppled everything. So I didn’t get the seafood fraud Divo. My dad did. The seafood fraud is basically, you know, uh, clams sounds like you had a little bit of order envy. I didn’t. And that’s the craziness of it. Oh, maybe a little bit, but oh, wow. so seafood fraud. It’s usually what, like my thing is, it’s basically, you know, clams.
Muscles calamari some shrimp with Langi and, and a spicy tomato broth. This was spicy and flavorful, man. It was phenomenal though, the sea tr Divo, but I did not have order envy. So the best thing I had this past week was from Schultz’s. It was a Sesame and tuna crust at sea tuna. A steak was, you know, like that thick, uh, for those you can’t seem like about two inches thick.
Over, uh, wasabi mashed potatoes with this like orange glaze syrup as well. Wow. Oh, I, I, I’m gonna be, uh, you know, salivating over that for the next few years here until I make my way back over. Wow. Yeah, that’s actually one of my favorite ways to eat tuna, the Sesame seed coating.
I’ve actually tried to make it at home way harder than I thought it was gonna be because tuna, you can go from, you can go from a beautiful piece with a, just a, a char on the outside and it’s raw through the middle to. Tuna salad in seconds. Yeah. And the first time I cooked tuna steaks, that’s what happened.
That is one, an expensive salad. Yeah. That’s an expensive tuna salad, man. Yeah. Yeah. Tuna is never cheap. I was, uh, that was one of my, uh, I, I like to say at home that. I suffer a defeat on three out of every 10 things that I cook. And that was within one of those three, uh, over the course of a month. So what’s, what’s the best thing you ate then?
I’m excited to be able to contribute what things I cook once I move out of the hotel in a few days here. oh yeah, man. You have been, uh, you know, living the hotel life, but uh, I think you’re back in soon. Yeah. Two more days. Yeah, well, it’s my house, not first, very two months, but two days until I have a kitchen again. Very cool for me.
The best thing that I cooked, I actually did eat out once this week. And it was ramen where I haven’t had ramen in a couple years. You know, it was kind of like the food of the moment. I feel like for a little while where all of these ramen places all across. All across the United States were popping up everywhere.
And I sort of, I sort of strayed from the path and stopped ordering it. Cause I had just had it so much, but there is this ramen place up the street that opened near me. It’s called glow noodle house. And boy was I blown away by this Rodman. It was a. Spicy, uh, miso bath based broth. It was called L Diablo and it was hot.
It was this perfect level of heat where, you know, my forehead’s beating up a little bit, but it’s so good. I’m just chowing down. The thing that really made this dish shine for me though, is they took this pork belly. And they had caramelized it to the point where it had essentially turned into bacon.
So it was a very light crisp on the outside, but then this, you know, you’d bite into it and you’d get this glorious bite of like fat that paired with a very spicy broth and some, uh, green onions. Oh man. It was. Out of this world. I have. It’s the most impress I’ve ever been with ramen, dude. I know where we’re eating next time.
Uh I’m in your neck of the woods. yeah, we got soup dumplings. When I come see you and we got ramen when you are in town and we’re working together here in Denver. I, I, I hope our audience enjoys the food conversations, just as much as the, you know, agency process conversations that we have here. Hopefully, this is a way to get people to stick around until the end, because they just want to hear about all the tasty food that we discuss.
And we’re not just like, you know, talking to each other here. So, if, if you’re still listening, you know, let us know in the comments, give us a five star review. In iTunes or Spotify or wherever you listen to your podcasts.We super appreciate it from y’all and let us know what the best thing you ate this week was there on a website, fill out a contact form. love it.
So that does it for episode six of designing growth. Thank you again so much for joining me Perry and looking forward to talking to you all again next week, until then we would love for you to go to apple. Or Spotify, like Perry had said, and give us a five star rating. If you like this content, if you don’t, you know, leave a comment with a one star review, either way helps us out.
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