From Building Prank Websites to Exiting an 8-Figure Agency

Overview:

Sam talks with digital marketing agency coach & advisor Jason Swenk. Jason tells the story of how he stumbled into creating his first web design agency, opens up about the struggles he faced growing his business to 8 figures, and gives advice for the five core areas of business other agency owners should be aware of when they go to scale up their businesses.

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https://youtu.be/lavEz11b6Ls

Resources from Episode 30:

• Agency Mastery 360
• Jason Swenk's Personal Website
• Agency Mastery 360 Podcast
• Jason Swenk's YouTube Channel
• Motion.io TikTok Account
• Motion.io YouTube Channel
• Motion.io Instagram Account
• Try Motion.io for Free

Episode Transcript:

[00:00:00] Sam Chlebowski: Happy Thursday everybody, andwelcome back to Designing Growth. Sam Schabowski here, co-founder of Motion.io.And as you know, because you're listening to this host of this podcast today, Iam very excited to bring on Jason Swenk to the podcast. Jason is an agencyadvisor and coach that guides marketing agencies through a proven framework forgrowing their agencies faster.

[00:00:36] In addition toliterally writing the book for growing an agency from nothing to eight figures,Jason hosts the Smart Agency Masterclass podcast, which is the number onemarketing agency owner podcast for sharing strategies and stories from realagency owners of what is working today in the agency.

[00:00:54] So Jason, withoutfurther ado, how you doing? How's today for you?

[00:00:57] Jason Swenk: Doing great. Thanks for having meon the show.

[00:00:59] Sam Chlebowski: So I am excited to kind of digin here and I wanted to first ask you how did you get your start in the agencyworld, to where you are now and the things that you're doing, within yourbusiness and the amazing content that you're putting out to help other agencyowners?

[00:01:15] Jason Swenk: Well, I think like many of uslistening to the show and many of us that have created agencies, I was anaccidental agency owner. You know, I knew how to do something cool, which wasdesign a website. and my first website was designing a website called “In Shit”.And it was basically because one of my friends looked like Justin Timberlakewhen NSYNC was popular.

[00:01:34] And then peoplestarted, and this was around 98, 99, and people started asking me to designwebsites for them. And so I got started by accident and then, you know, overtime of, you know, the struggling and hitting my head, Creating that great bigprison around my agency because I, I was being reactive rather than proactive.

[00:01:54] I started to getsmart and started to create systems and then over 12 years of growing, we grewover eight figures and we were able to have a really successful exit. And thenfrom there, this business, the Agency Mastery 360 - I kind of fell into that byaccident too. I had some of my old competitors that ran agencies were like,how'd you work with LegalZoom?

[00:02:14] How'd you work withHitachi? How'd you work with Aflac? How'd you do X, Y, and Z? How'd you sell?And just started helping 'em out for free. And, and then my wife at the timewas like, why don't you create that as a business? You're just bored sittingaround the house doing nothing. Um, and then I, that came into a podcast and amastery and that kind of stuff.

[00:02:33] So that's, that'show we got.

[00:02:35] Sam Chlebowski: What an amazing story, andit's cool to hear a specific part of your story for me, and that is that partabout exiting your business because it's something that I don't know if there'sa ton of. , you know, education out there besides, you know, some of the stuffthat you put out about exiting a business.

[00:02:54] And that's somethingthat we did, at Brighter Vision . We exited that business back in 2020. Whatlessons would you say that you've learned about, scaling up and exiting anagency that you wish you could have, told your former self ahead of time?

[00:03:11] Jason Swenk: there's a couple things, right?And if you go back to kind of the origin story of, of mine, of like accidentalagency owner, what misses out for a couple different years is that clarity inthat direction of where you're going. You're just, you're getting people tocoming to you and you're designing and you're building or doing marketing orwhatever. and then you keep getting referrals from that. Like, and I look at abusiness, if your business is based on majority referrals, you don't have ascalable business cuz that's just not dependable and you don't have the rightsystems. And it's hard to do that because then you have to kind of get a laserfocused.

[00:03:44] I got to a pointwhere we were a couple million at the time. I think this was around oh seven.Because it was right before two, or maybe it was 2008, when everything went toshit. Kind of like everyone always freaks out, right? Recession. I'm like,well, that's your greatest opportunity. But I think it was around this timeand, and I was miserable at the agency.

[00:04:03] I literally hated it.I literally wanted to just burn it down. I was, my wife even told me to go geta job. I actually even took an interview and they asked me a couple differentquestions that really changed my trajectory. For good. And they basically askedme, what do you wanna do every day? And what don't you never want to do everagain?

[00:04:22] And I was like, huh.Like I, I couldn't answer it. Then I, I had to go home. And when I went home, Iliterally, um, took a sheet of paper and I said, well, thinking about what Iwant do every day is a lot harder than thinking about all the shit I want toget. And so I literally kind of drew a circle over my, like I put my fist onthe piece of paper, drew a circle around it.

[00:04:47] Everything outsidethe circle was all the stuff I wanted to avoid. And so I was like, projectmanagement, count management, um, client retention, billing, like all the, likeall this shit. But, you know, we, I didn't, I didn't design a website and getinto this business to do. And so I started there and spent about an hour.

[00:05:06] I was like, and thenI started thinking all the stuff I like doing. I like coaching my team. I likecreating content. I like speaking, right? Like I like being the face. And thenI was able to kind of get that direction of where I wanted to go for me, like Ibuilt the business around me first, and then I was able to come up with.

[00:05:29] You know, my core orthe company's core values from my core values , right? Because I wanna bearound people that believe in what I believe in. I think like with, withexiting the your, your guys company and probably what you're building at motionnow, similar, right? You're not just hiring people to do a particular task.

[00:05:47] You're wantingpeople that believe in your vision that can kind of take it. And that's part ofthe thing of building a a business, that you have the opportunity to exit. Youhave to have direction. and you have to have people that believe in thatdirection before anything else happens. And most people don't get to there.

[00:06:04] They just get, theybuild a business that makes money, but it's a prison around them. And then theywant to sell because there's one little thing or a couple little things that ifthey could get rid of today, they'd be like, oh no, I wouldn't sell. And that'swhen they, they come to me like, I only believe you should sell your agency ifyou get to a point where you need the money.

[00:06:25] You absolutely justhate everything. Like there's nothing . Right? Right. Um, or you have visionsfor the next thing you want to do. Because I can tell you, once I sold theagency, I was completely bored. I was completely depressed cuz I didn't havethat significance anymore. Right. Those big companies weren't coming to meanymore, making me feel good.

[00:06:44] My team wasn'tcoming to me cuz I didn't have a team anymore. so you just gotta think all ofthat.

[00:06:48] Sam Chlebowski: What would you say to somebodywho maybe has a web design shop right now where they have more clients thanthey can handle, but they are pretty steadfast in wanting to stay as like asolopreneur kind of solo owner operator of their.

[00:07:04] Jason Swenk: you have to do what's right foryou. Some people wanna stay small, but they may be staying small becausethey're misinformed or they're, misconceptions in their mind, right betweentheir ears. . So like I look at it as like, think about when you start, you'rein that fun stage, right?

[00:07:18] Everything's good,you're getting clients, you're making money, and then you start getting morebusiness. And what happens is it gets more complex cuz you have to bring onpeople. And now you're in a business where you're managing people not doing thestuff that you'd loved. And now some people actually do better at managingpeople.

[00:07:33] And they were like,good, I didn't want to do the design anyway. And what happens is you you hirethese people and you're kind of a, I can't remember the author that wrote this,but he talks about you're kind of in this whitewater, right? The ups and downs,ups and down. And the only way through this stage is through hiring or havingthe right systems in place, because then you have the right systems in place todouble, triple, quadruple your capacity.

[00:07:56] But what most agencyowners are thinking well, I'm already maxed out. I'm already working 80 hoursa. I can't double my business cuz I'm doing everything and that means I, I haveto work 160 hours. But if they realize going, um, and I'll give a shout out to,uh, my buddy Dan Martel. He just came up with a really good book called BuyBack Your Time.

[00:08:16] And he did a, aworkshop for, um, our agency Mastery, uh, which is like a community for agencyowners that want to really master the. and what he talks about is you thinkabout hiring for more capacity at your agency, but how can you buy back some ofyour time and thinking about, and he, and this hit me right between the eyes,he goes, if you don't have an executive assistant, you're the executiveassistant, you're paying too much.

[00:08:42] Right? So look atall those low level items, right? Or everyone should kind of check out ToddHerman, cuz he talks about the 90 day, uh, you know, work week, uh, which is a,a coach and mentor of mine, right? think of, um, how can I eliminate a lot ofthe BS that I'm doing now so I can really kind of transform into the leader?

[00:09:06] And so I look atrunning an agency. transforming from an owner to a C E O. Here's the fiveroles, okay? And you want to get to this, this part that as fast as youpossibly can, and then hire people that does everything else. So think aboutthe first one I've already kind of gone over. Set the vision and the directionfor the agency, right?

[00:09:28] This will enableyour team to make decisions without you. I'll give you an example. Um, this wasat my business, maybe eight years. We were, I told my team, I said, write, um,write an article or a blog post on the top 20 conferences for agency owners togo to. They came back with 20, they had four of, or three or four of 'em.

[00:09:51] I couldn't standthat conference. I hated these people , right? I go take that shit out like Idon't like them. And my team said, now I've set the vision for them cuz ourvision is to be a resource I wish I had when I was running the first agency.Um, and they go, is the conference not good? I said, no, I hate these people,but it's good for the agencies.

[00:10:14] I'm like, okay, Isee what you're saying. Run with it. Right? So they can make better decisionsand they can call you out on your dumb ship. Number two is being the face ofthe organization. Now, most people don't want to do that because they thinkeveryone's gonna want to come to you. Perfect example for this is GaryVanderchuck of Vander.

[00:10:32] Do you think heworks on anybody's account? Hell no. He doesn't , right? But they come to himfor that. So you'd be gotta be, the face of the agency should be creatingcontent, kind of like what you guys are doing. Number three, you should coachand mentor your leadership team. Now, if you're coaching and mentoringeveryone, you're, you're messing up like you should have no more than fivedirect. Because your whole job is to coach them, to get them to where they needto be better in the business and better for themselves. Okay. Number three isbuild the key strategic relationships that only you can do. And then the lastpart is understand the KPIs. You don't have to be an Excel nerd or, or geek orwhatever people call 'em now nowadays, right?

[00:11:17] Just understand whatare the metrics that we're going. you know, what's the kind of growth, growth,um, uh, net profit margins that we need to be at? You know, where are we going?What can we, like, how much are we bringing in? Uh, you know, someone told meat, in, in our mastery, they go, if I was on a deserted island, here are theKPIs that I would want to know if the business is doing.

[00:11:39] Okay. So those arethe five.

[00:11:41] Sam Chlebowski: These, five core roles or, youknow, areas within your business. It's really cool to hear, especially fromyou, somebody with, you know, much more experience. this point I, you know, Ithink you have 10 years or something on me at least within your career.

[00:11:54] and I just finish upthis guide that I'll be kind of releasing over the next couple weeks. That is,how to start a web design agency and it's part one from kind of your earlieststeps. Part two is kind of in that middle growth phase, and then part three isall about scaling up the things that you just mentioned.

[00:12:09] almost exactly whatI had wrote down. and what I kind of communicate in that video series it'sincredibly important stuff. That idea of. Not only removing yourself from tasksand finding people who you trust that can lead departments, that can leadinitiatives on their own, that are capable of kind of that project-based work,but aligning a team around that through, key performance indicators, OKRs, youknow, whatever you want to call them.

[00:12:35] But having thosegoals, down in writing is, kind of a big part of that. There's that stage, ofcourse, when you're going from zero to one, but how you get from one to two ortwo to three, that requires a lot more clear communication of the overallgoals, in my opinion.

[00:12:51] And it sounds likeyou would've agree. And I think that those KPIs are kind of a fundamental partof getting there. I kind of just wanted to switch gears a little bit here,because I know on your own podcast you are talking to a lot of people in themarketing space and the kind of the cool things that you're doing now, I wantedto get your general sense of within the agency world, how has the marketinglandscape changed within the past two?

[00:13:15] Jason Swenk: ever since Covid, it's actuallyhad a, a pretty big effect. People have really realized that digital marketingis what people need. And then, you know, it's changing even more every dayreally, with a lot of these AI tools out there. Uh, you know, chat GBT andcopy.ai and Jasper, and there's, I mean, there's, there's literally AI toolsthat will write websites and landing pages and it, it's, it's things that canmake us more e. and literally the other day I go, I was using, I said, um, Iwas doing a video and I was, I, I was saying, I don't wanna watch this eightminute video to write this description. So literally, I, I ran this through anengine, gave me the transcript, put the transcript in chat, G B T or whatever,copy AI tools out there, said, write me a description for YouTube.

[00:14:09] Wrote me adescription, then write me a title for it. I mean, it was, and I was like, man,you know, like we have all the, like in the old days when go back to, you know,horse and buggy days, like we had to, you know, watch the video and then writereally bad copy and then, you know, have someone fix the grammar and fix thespelling and then post like, like, it's just, we're getting a lot moreefficient and that's what I'm real excited about for agencies.

[00:14:39] Because now, like,and this is where it's gonna really hurt people, is the, the low level people,right? Like people at the fiver level, like they're gonna go away, like AI'sgonna replace that, but they're never gonna replace the middle and the the highend tiers.

[00:14:52] Sam Chlebowski: And I think in some waysbecause content creation has gotten more efficient. Even examples like you justshared with chat G P T and other AI programs. because of that it has kind of aresounding effect where because people are putting out more content. Whenpeople are looking for marketing design services, they're really going togravitate towards people that.

[00:15:14] They align their ownvalues with, or their company's values with, because people are able to put outmore content, they're able to kind of express who they are and the values oftheir company and their brand more. I think it really starts to make it whenyou know a client is looking for those services, they want to find somebodythat's like them.

[00:15:31] They want to findsomebody that has done work with similar clients. and because they can findthat information, they can find those agencies much more.

[00:15:39] Jason Swenk: I totally agree.

[00:15:40] Sam Chlebowski: In terms of tactics, forgrowth, one of the things that I've seen is, the way that kind of the standardplaybook has changed within, the last like five to seven years when we werefirst getting going at, brighter Vision, that was the agency that I was workingwith my co-founder at.

[00:15:57] there's a standardplaybook of like blog newsletter, Google Ads. We started to mix in somewebinars at the end there, but what has really changed I think, in the lastcouple of years is this focus on organic content, but not just any old organiccontent, high quality video content. That can be distributed in multiple waysacross multiple platforms.

[00:16:22] know that you do alot of video, you have your YouTube channel and then you are posting, clips ofthat on the various platforms. is that something that you would agree with thatsort of shift and focus kind of towards video content? And what do people needto know about video content as a part of their marketing?

[00:16:41] Jason Swenk: Yeah. I mean, that goes back tokind of the number three thing, or I, I can't remember which number order Ihad, but you know, being the face of the organization, right? Like you're notonly building the brand of the agency, but you gotta build your personal brand,all right? Like, I think too many times people think, well, and, and I madethis mistake at my agency, or it could have been a lot bigger.

[00:17:04] I never brandedmyself, I never wanted to toot my own horn. I still hate it, but you just, youhave to do it. There's some people that love to toot their own horn. We allknow who those people are, but, um, and no one listening on this show wants totooth their horn. So, um, y'all agree? So I think. When I, when I started thisbusiness is really when I started getting into a lot of video.

[00:17:27] And the reason beingwas there was only a couple people actually helping agencies at the time, andthey were all just blogging and just writing, but you couldn't figure out theirtone or their personality. And I was like, well, I wanna create a vi and plus Isucked at grammar and not all these AI tools were out there, right?

[00:17:47] So, um, Grammarlydidn't exist, which is one of my favorite. Makes me look smart. And so I was areally bad writer, but I was a better communicator. Even though a lot of, ifyou go back and watch some of my first videos, I look like a hostage and likethe video was really bad, but the content was good. And I was like, I cancommunicate my personality in order to attract people that believe in what Ibelieve in.

[00:18:11] Like I don't wear asuit and tie. I'm not gonna attract those suit and tie people like buttoned up.There's places you go. I'm more of a ball cap t-shirt guy that I'll tell youhow it is. Like if you stink at something, I'm gonna tell you, you stink atsomething and this is what you need to do if you wanna fix it. So I could getmy personality through that. And people buy from people, not brands. And sothat's why I feel if, if you can create the macro content, right? Like we're.and then you slice it up into the micro content for other things like you know,per platform specific. Then you know, over time you're going to get a lot ofmomentum and you're gonna build that moat around your business where mostpeople can't touch you because most people, like when I started, I think therewas maybe one other agency podcast out there when I started eight years.

[00:19:05] Now I could, Icouldn't even tell you how many there are, but most people give up after acouple months. Hell, I, I would love to look up the percentage. I need to hirean assistant and do this. Look up the percentage of people that stick with itover a year. I bet it's not many, um, because you don't see that momentum for along time.

[00:19:25] So it's a biginvestment in your time, but it's the best payoff that you could ever do.

[00:19:31] Sam Chlebowski: I could not agree more, andit's something that I have only just started to realize the benefits of,starting this podcast back in. July. It is definitely a struggle first becauseyou're putting this stuff out and nobody's listening. You feel like you'respending way too much time, more than you should, producing these things andclipping it up and putting it out on the platforms.

[00:19:53] But my two bigtakeaways that I've found are, number one, it starts to get faster and easier.the more experience you get as you get like templates built out, as you get aprocess built out and. Number two, content and having a library of content haskind of this snowball effect where.

[00:20:10] People aren't gonnalisten to a podcast with two to three episodes. People aren't going tosubscribe to a YouTube channel with two to three videos. You just have to buildup that library, and that's when you can really start seeing kind of thebenefits of that. So those were kind of two things that I've realized.

[00:20:27] You know, sincewe've begun this journey at Motion io and kind of building out our contentstreams,

[00:20:32] a question alongthese lines of Systems and processes, and I know that's a big part of what youhelp other agency owners do. let's say, for an agency owner out there that haskind of reached, flat growth, it's kind of like a plateau. Maybe they've hireda couple people, they're getting leads consistently, but it's not growing monthover month.

[00:20:52] What are the keysystems that they need to be looking at and what are the things that they shouldbe doing at that point in their business to break through to that next levelof.

[00:21:01] Jason Swenk: When people say, I'm getting someleads, right? And or plenty of leads. It's depending on what type of leads,right? Is it the same leads that you've been getting or is it the leads thatyou actually need in order to scale? so for example, most agencies that aretrying to scale, they think they need to double their client base.

[00:21:20] Ah, you just need todouble your pricing. and they're like, well, my current clients wouldn't paythat. Oh no, no shit. Like you need to go get new clients and new, you know,have new prospects coming to you and new leads. And so here's the 10% rule.Okay? This is like, let's say you were starting up for zero or you just wannamake it over.

[00:21:40] Most people justwanna make it over the seven figures, which. is some kind of mountain that theywant to climb, but I also tell them it's more important on profit. Like I'vemet a lot of $10 million agencies that are 1% profitable. I'm like, that sucks.Like that really sucks. Like we need to switch that and really look at it.

[00:21:59] So here's the 10%rule. I want you to make a list of a hundred perfect prospects that you want togo. That can pay you double that fee. So let's say you wanna do seven figures.I want you to find 10 or, or list out a hundred people that can pay you $9,000a month. Now what you're gonna do is the next step is I want you to researchthem.

[00:22:25] Who, who do I needto contact? um, who are the people, um, what's the opportunity for them? What'sthe challenges, right? That's step number two. Three is what's the irresistibleoffer to them? So like a lot of times what we do, um, I'll tell you ourirresistible offer, I say, you know, Hey, uh, go to this website.

[00:22:47] and if you're anagency owner and you're wanting us to do you an agency blueprint where we'llactually map you out how you can double or triple your agency, you know,together go to this and then here's the irresistible part and be like, Hey,you'll love the plan. You'll go execute it yourself. Perfect.

[00:23:07] Wish you luck.Number two, which is the most common? You love the plan. You want our help?Great. We'll help you. Three. You hate the plan. We'll give you your money back.There's nothing for you to lose. So that's an irresistible offer. And thenwhat, what you're going to do is transition from that foot in the door.

[00:23:22] I call that a foot,A foot in the door offer, right? Because they're paying you now, they're 10times more likely to pay you again. And I don't care what you charge for it. Ihave people charge 300 bucks. I have people that charge 20,000. It doesn'treally matter. Um, because there's no risk for that person.

[00:23:38] That's theirresistible. then you do like a, a project for them fixing something that youguys outlined, something that shows value impact to them. So if you weredesigning a website, maybe you did, um, a, uh, let's say you do a site map.Coming up with a site map is really hard. Like where do things need to go andwhat pages do we need to have?

[00:24:03] Then the projectcould be more of a deeper web. and show them some results, and then ultimatelywould be, you know, a retainer to, to build out everything and maintain it.Now, if you do that, the 10% rule is you made a a hundred people list, youcontacted a hundred people and you chatted with a hundred people.

[00:24:23] All you have to dois convert. Convert 10% of them, 10 of them paying you. 9,000 is over amillion, but most people don't wanna put in the. into that, or thinking aboutor making that list. They're just waiting for people to come to you or they're,and here's the cop out for a lot of agencies, they try to be a white labelsolution to other agencies.

[00:24:45] I think that's copout because they're gonna pay you shit fees. They're gonna treat you like shit.They're not gonna follow your process. I've b I've done this, like I've workedwith the biggest agencies in the world and they're idiot. Um, because theydidn't follow our process and they were the biggest agency and they said, yougotta follow our process.

[00:25:03] I'm like, it it likeyou never worked out. Make sense?

[00:25:08] Sam Chlebowski: Yep. what you had shared aboutbuilding that list of, you know, those hundred people that you want to go afterand those hundred, you know, sort of target accounts. it's something that I'veused for. Other parts of businesses as well. It's like partnerships. Like, Hey,what are the hundred people that you would love to partner with that you thinkyou have synergy with that could share, about your services that can referclients back and forth and go after them.

[00:25:32] whether you're usingit as a way to get clients or whether you're using it as a way to land newpartnerships. I do think it's something that, takes time to do. , it can beeasy to put off and not want to do that work, but I, I will say that like Igonna a hundred percent vouch for the strategy because it works it helps reallyalign you and your goals and where you want to get to, with the steps needed totake you there.

[00:25:57] So couldn't agreemore

[00:25:58] outside of work,Jason what are you passionate about? What do you like to do? how do you spendyour.

[00:26:02] Jason Swenk: Well, I live in, uh, Colorado, inthe mountains and,

[00:26:05] Sam Chlebowski: Oh, where at?

[00:26:06] Jason Swenk: in Durango, Colorado

[00:26:07] Sam Chlebowski: Oh, you live in Durango.That's crazy. My wife is, from Durango. She, uh, grew up there. Her wholefamily still lives there.

[00:26:15] Jason Swenk: Oh, very cool. Small world.

[00:26:17] So, um, we built ourdream house on our dream property. and so I spend most of my time in theoutdoors, hiking, mountains, snowboarding, skiing, my own biking, climbing,doing all kinds of outdoor adventures. So that's, that's what I spend my timedoing.

[00:26:31] Sam Chlebowski: Very cool. Well, if I am, I amabout to have a kid, so it's, uh, you know, it could be a little bit beforewe're up there again, but if I'm back in the neighborhood, Now that I know thatyou're a mountain biker, I will definitely, let you know ahead of time. I, uh,I've done not a ton of riding out there, but have been on a couple rides outthere and it's really, really fun terrain.

[00:26:50] Jason Swenk: Yeah, it's the best mountainbiking in the world, someone was telling me that Durangos had an Olympian andsome kind of bike Olympics every year for the past 40 years or something likethat.

[00:27:02] Sam Chlebowski: Yeah. and the first American,uh, winner of a stage of the tort of. From Durango and that

[00:27:08] Jason Swenk: Yeah. That was this past year.

[00:27:13] SamChlebowski: Wild stuff. It’s cool that we share that connectionthat's, wild that you are out in Durango.

[00:27:19] Very cool. Well,thank you so much Jason for coming on, sharing your time, sharing yourexpertise. This has been a great episode. one final question before we closeout here. If people wanna learn more about you and what you are doing, whereshould they go?

[00:27:33] Jason Swenk: Yep. So easy website to go to is AgencyMastery360.com.That's where we put all our resources. I always find that agency owners need tomaster three things: attract, convert, and scale. And that whole website'sdedicated to building a community around that. So go to AgencyMastery360.com.

[00:27:51] Sam Chlebowski: And I, we will put links toJason's website here in the show. Notes for this episode. until then everybody,this has been another great episode of Designing Growth. Thanks for tuning in.If you're liking the content that we're putting out we would also love for youto go leave us a five star review. Apple, Spotify - hit that five-star reviewbutton. That would be awesome. And if you don't like the content that you'rehearing, that's okay. Leave us a comment, send us a message and tell us what weshould cover next. With that, thanks again Jason, and talk to you soon. Every.